Why Friends With Benefits Does Not Work

high-heels-by-bedThe idea sounds simple enough — you’re single and not looking for a relationship or commitment. You’d like to be physically intimate with someone, but you’re not interested in strangers and one-night stands. You have a friend with whom you’ve always shared a mutual attraction. This friend is also more interested in the physical aspects of a relationship. Why not become “friends with benefits” (FWB) – friends who occasionally engage in non-committal sex? Isn’t this the best way to satisfy both of your needs without having to deal with the “messier” parts of relationships?

Not really. Friends with benefits arrangements aren’t as gratifying and easy as they seem to be. And while some people can maintain casual sexual relationships, just as many can not. In the long run, the benefits of having a friend with benefits may not outweigh the costs.

Being friends with benefits isn’t less stressful

A common reason cited for participating in FWB arrangements is that there is less of the stress that comes with a traditional relationship. No need to keep in constant contact, no need to pay any special attention outside of the bedroom, and no need to deal with emotions.

But studies on FWB relationships contradict this idea. In fact, one study found that friends with benefits deal with the same issues that those in traditional relationships do – worries like one partner becoming more attached than the other or becoming jealous. These fears are well-founded since one partner does tend to develop feelings in a FWB situation. Those who describe themselves as jealous are, ironically, more likely to participate in a FWB relationship.

The boundaries are not clear

In the ideal friends with benefits situation, both participants would be certain of what to expect from their affair. However, this is usually not the case. FWBs often jump into the arrangement without clearly defining the limits. This makes the situation more difficult later on.

do-not-disturb-signEven when the boundaries are clear at the beginning, they can become fuzzy. The partners may start out expecting the same, but one partner begins to hope for more, or wants to go back to being friends with no sexual contact. One partner may have secretly always wanted a commited relationship with the other person. They settle on the friends with benefits arrangement in hopes that it would evolve into something more. They may take what they can get at the moment, then realize they can no longer be simply a bed buddy.

Communication breaks down

In addition to having to deal with many of the worries that those in committed relationship do, friends with benefits comes with its own problems. One of those is the breakdown of communication. Where two people were once friends, the previously mentioned study found that as FWBs, they only discuss the physical side of their partnership. They are afraid to talk about anything else, especially the possibility of a committed relationship and their friendship outside of the bed. As a result, they don’t know how the affair is progressing and how the other feels about their relationship.

The likely result: friendless, sexless, and relationship-less

Only around 10 percent of FWB relationships evolve into long-term, committed relationships, according to research. Many end up breaking up both the friendship and the sexual relationship, and even more decide that they can no longer have the friends with benefits relationship. Even when a FWB relationship is maintained long-term, partners report less passion than those in traditional relationships. It turns out that being friends with benefits can be less than beneficial.

What are your thoughts on the friends with benefits relationship? Have you ever been in one or considered being in one?

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107 thoughts on “Why Friends With Benefits Does Not Work

  1. My opinion and mine alone, I’m not here to judge anyone, nor do I really care about what other people do ;)

    I don’t do stuff like this. I just don’t decide on a whim to have sex with a person, it’s not how I was raised. It’s just not for me to have sex with someone for just the empty sex sake. I had hubby blue-balling for months (yes really) before he got some this fine ass.

    Yeah, you can imagine what would could happen to the black girl who sluts it up in South Africa.

    What prompted this post Alee ? :)

  2. Nkosazana,

    “I just don’t decide on a whim to have sex with a person, it’s not how I was raised.”

    What if it’s not on a whim; what if you’ve planned for a while? :)

    “I had hubby blue-balling for months (yes really) before he got some this fine ass.”

    LOL. You kill me, sometimes.

    “What prompted this post Alee ?”

    Nothing, really. It was just an idea I’d had, so I decided to follow-through on it.

  3. What if it’s not on a whim; what if you’ve planned for a while?

    Well I kinda did with hubby. I pretty much set a date and said if we last that long time then he’s probably for real and would not dump me after it.

    But just with some random attractive friend? Hmm. Lets just say its not for me :)

    LOL. You kill me, sometimes.

    I promise it had nothing to do with him being white that I waited so long time. Nope nothing at all. I’d never discriminate. Well just a little bit. My little revenge for apartheid and making sure he was for real.

    Unfair? Maybe. But I’ve seen those white girls with jungle fever and those relationships don’t last very long.

    Have you tried this (FWB)? and how long do you usually let a man wait? or are you a first date girl? :)

  4. Nkosazana,

    “I promise it had nothing to do with him being white that I waited so long time.”

    I wasn’t even thinking about that. Funny you should bring it up. :)

    “Well just a little bit. My little revenge for apartheid and making sure he was for real.”

    Lol. Wow. But he wasn’t even a part of apartheid — you can’t fault him for his skin tone!

    Haven’t tried FWBs, and even if I were interested in it, none of my guy friends attract me on that level. (Ironic, since many of them became friends because one or both of us were attracted to the other.)

    “how long do you usually let a man wait? or are you a first date girl?”

    :X

    ;)

  5. This post is most informative. I had a FWB a long time ago, and basically this gent was crazy about me, but A-F-R-A-I-D so he proposed this arrangement. As indicated in the research you quoted, I began to develop deeper feelings for him, and so I told him I could no longer see him on a casual basis. Then he had to confront the deep feelings he already had for me and then it blew up.

    I understand that urge to “get your itch scratched”, especially when you haven’t been on a date in a long time, but I agree that this FWB thang is more often than not a hot mess.

  6. Lol. Wow. But he wasn’t even a part of apartheid — you can’t fault him for his skin tone!

    Well, I was a bit silly back then. I still am :)

    Making out with hubby and saying “no more!” if he tried to get frisky, all the while thinking this is for you Steve Biko! I’m doing it for you!

    And ain’t that what black people are suppose to do? (according to some at least)

    I got to give it to hubby though. How many men would keep putting it off for month nowadays?..

    :X

    You Americans are such a bunch of prudes, you do well with spending some time with my gogo or some other zulu women ;)

  7. Sherry,

    How interesting that he wasn’t overjoyed that you had feelings for him too. It seems like it should have worked out nicely, for him at least. As long as he didn’t see it as you rushing him from going to FWBs to a committed relationship.

    Nkosazana,

    “How many men would keep putting it off for month nowadays?..”

    Lots. If they had no other choice. ;)

    I’m no prude, but this post is not entitled “Alee Tells You About Her Private Life”… Maybe some other time. :)

  8. FWB is one of those things that sound good in theory… But not in reality.

    First of all: what does “friend” mean in this situation? If this is a close friend… You simply don’t go around having sex with a close friend and then expect to continue friendship like nothing happened. Some people do that, but it might work as a beginning of a true relationship, not FWB. So your FWB mustn’t be a close friend in the first place. I’ve never had such a friend.

    I have only a few friends, all females, and I was never one of those girls guys befriend because they find them attractive. So, FWB was never an option for me, so I guess I never thought about it.

    That being said, while I’m not into casual sex (for reasons unrelated to morals), I can definitely understand why people… um, want to have sex even if they’re not in a relationship. I am one of those people who value relationships so I don’t really understand what is like to just want to be single, but I know what is like to be single and – how shall I put this – not getting any.

    I was in a long term relationship that ended badly when I was a few months short of 20. (We dated for about two years). I as a wreck after that relationship. I mean, I was 18 when we’ve met and I was all about he’s the bestest and omgz, 6’3″ and omgz etc etc etc. I guess I was addicted and he was an avoidant type. Anyway, after that relationship I was single for 3 years. No dating. No flirting. Nothing.

    So yes, not having sex with another person was another bad thing about it. I admit it, it is something I need, regardless if I’m in a relationship or not. But I know casual sex doesn’t work for me, because men simply don’t try at all in one night stands, so, why bother?

    All in all, I wouldn’t say FWB didn’t cross my mind when I was single, but I didn’t have any friends available, so I never tried it. Now I think it’s better that way, because I would probably end up being attached to that person. I did, however, try something bad- sex with an ex, and, while it didn’t hurt me that much, it sure didn’t help my healing process (because, it basically just prolonged the whole thing).

  9. Oh, and I’ve noticed something about the effect Alee has on me… I am usually less than ready to share my personal stories online. But for some reason, I feel safe here. :D

  10. Mira,

    ‘what does “friend” mean in this situation?’

    It seems to mean what it usually means, but I doubt it’s a close, close friend. Usually it’s a casual friend, or someone that turned into a friend based on the FWB arrangement.

    “I was all about he’s the bestest and omgz, 6’3″ and omgz etc etc etc.”

    6’3″? You were right the first time — omgz etc etc. ;)

    “I guess I was addicted and he was an avoidant type.”

    Why does it seem like all the sexy ones are avoidant? :(

    “I wouldn’t say FWB didn’t cross my mind when I was single, but I didn’t have any friends available, so I never tried it. Now I think it’s better that way, because I would probably end up being attached to that person.”

    Yes. I would really not recommend FWBs for an anxious type or a person whose emotions become easily attached. Casual sex of any sort is a recipe for disaster.

    “Oh, and I’ve noticed something about the effect Alee has on me… I am usually less than ready to share my personal stories online. But for some reason, I feel safe here. “

    I’m glad you feel safe (and it is safe here, I make sure of that ;) ). I’ve been sharing more here as well, but I’m still pretty private for a blogger. Slowly but surely I shall open…

  11. Usually it’s a casual friend, or someone that turned into a friend based on the FWB arrangement.

    I get that. What I don’t understand is the type of relationship you have with FWB outside the bedroom. Do you spend some time together as friends? Or not at all? If not, it’s not FWB… It’s just casual sex with a stranger.

    6’3″? You were right the first time — omgz etc etc. ;)

    Yes, but it seems that only tall guys were interested in me. When I was young women in my family told me it’s ok to be a short girl: it means you can date both short and tall men. But short guys were never interested in me. They went for girls taller than themselves all the time. And not many guys under 5’9″ were ever interested in me. (I’m 5’2″) Weird, huh?

    Why does it seem like all the sexy ones are avoidant? :(

    I think because sexy people know there will always be others interested in them, even if they don’t try. I don’t know. My ex wasn’t really avoidant by nature/personality, but he did his best to act like one. (Remember, avoidant traits are praised, particularly among 18 year old guys). In reality, he was a bit inexperienced (sexually), so he did get attached to me, but his friends discouraged this “unmanly” behavior and encouraged him to seek other girls, have casual fun, etc. So I do think avoidants are not born, they are created. :D

    Yes. I would really not recommend FWBs for an anxious type or a person whose emotions become easily attached. Casual sex of any sort is a recipe for disaster.

    True, but what to do then? What should anxious people do when they are not in a relationship but want to have sex? I am anxious, but I don’t think it’s impossible to have sex outside a relationship. In a way, I do believe sex and love are not the same thing; you can have sex without love (I don’t think you can truly love without sex, though). I am just not sure if there is a way for anxious types to have sex outside a relationship.

    I’m glad you feel safe (and it is safe here, I make sure of that ;) ). I’ve been sharing more here as well, but I’m still pretty private for a blogger. Slowly but surely I shall open…

    I am a very private blogger, too. But like I said, I feel safe here. I’d love to read more about you and your life, but I 100% understand if you don’t feel like sharing private details.

  12. Mira,

    “What I don’t understand is the type of relationship you have with FWB outside the bedroom. Do you spend some time together as friends?”

    Not really. According to the study I quoted, FWBs tend to talk mainly about their physical relationship, even outside of the bedroom. Communication breaks down; the whole “friend” side of the friendship is lessened.

    “it seems that only tall guys were interested in me.”

    Not a bad position to be in. Not bad at all. :)

    “I think because sexy people know there will always be others interested in them, even if they don’t try. I don’t know.”

    That’s probably a good part of the reason. I know men who think they are too good-looking to stick to one woman.

    “My ex wasn’t really avoidant by nature/personality, but he did his best to act like one…So I do think avoidants are not born, they are created. :D”

    Lol. Some are, some definitely are.

    “What should anxious people do when they are not in a relationship but want to have sex?”

    Find another relationship? ;)

    Seriously, I don’t think it’s a good idea to have casual sex when you’re an anxious type. Unless you’re only a moderately anxious or have found some way to separate love and sex (as you seem to have).

    Otherwise, if you’re an extremely anxious person, you probably get all bent out of shape from seeing a person you merely kissed with another person or knowing they don’t have feelings for you. It is possible to have casual sex, but it comes at a hefty price. It’s your choice to decide if you’re willing to pay that price.

    “I’d love to read more about you and your life, but I 100% understand if you don’t feel like sharing private details.”

    I’ll share every now and then. But I’m naturally a private person, plus I have bad experiences with sharing too much personal information online. But I’ll drop breadcrumbs for you all once in a while…

  13. It can only be ‘good’ for a little while then it goes bad quick and for the reasons stated above. Personally it would be easier to have a one night stand, that way only your ego gets hurt and not your feelings.

  14. Oh, hai Eugenia. Welcome. :)

    “It can only be ‘good’ for a little while then it goes bad quick”

    That’s basically how it’s been summed up by many: “Good until it isn’t”.

    “Personally it would be easier to have a one night stand, that way only your ego gets hurt and not your feelings.”

    There are definite pros with a one night stand versus a FWBs relationship. At the very least you can pretend it never happened because you’ll probably never see the person again. ;)

  15. I agree, but one nights stands have one huge problem (besides the fact you’re doing it with a stranger so you must be extra careful with protection): men don’t invest themselves in these things. And when I say “invest”, I mean sexually.

    Seriously, they don’t even try. Men rarely try to satisfy a woman they don’t care about, and no man cares about the women they have one night stand with. Many men are selfish lovers anyway, and they are just lazy and uninspired when it comes to one night stand, imo.

  16. Maybe you could help out by saying “I’ve never had a good one-night stand” or “Most one-night standers make my vibrator look heavenly.” ???
    :D

  17. Hahahaah… Good tips. But, I am not sure if it helps. I mean, I find it very confusing, the whole thing. Shouldn’t guys try to show their best (sexually), since the encounter is based on sex only? But it looks like they don’t even try. Some guys I know openly talk about it (about not caring), and then I ask whether they care if a girl thinks they are lousy lovers. I never get a proper answer.

  18. Mira,

    “Shouldn’t guys try to show their best (sexually), since the encounter is based on sex only?”

    That’s what I thought they did. I haven’t heard too many women complain about one-night stands in terms of their quality. Then again I haven’t done much detective work on the matter…

  19. I haven’t heard too many women complain about one-night stands in terms of their quality.

    It’s the opposite with me. All the women complain about it as being less than ok. Of course, most of them refuse to talk about it (refuse to admit they’ve tried it), so I guess my sample isn’t big. Still, it is something that prevented me from searching one nights stands when I was single. I sure didn’t need a lousy sex with a man who thinks women who have one nights stands are sluts.

  20. I agree, but one nights stands have one huge problem (besides the fact you’re doing it with a stranger so you must be extra careful with protection): men don’t invest themselves in these things. And when I say “invest”, I mean sexually

    You’re right Mira but usually with a one night stand, you should kinda already know that. LOL.

    That’s basically how it’s been summed up by many: “Good until it isn’t”.

    Hiya! Alee, I like your site.
    I think it’s worse because as you say, someone is becoming emotionally invested which is bound to happen. Really as people we can really be imaginative so they may be really hyping up the ‘possible’ relationship and it’s such a huge disappointment when you never turn that corner on the FWB thing. And yes at least with a one nighter you can always pretend but investing weeks or months in an FWB it’s hard to pretend like that happened, even harder to pretend that it don’t hurt.

  21. I guess I get to be the expert here–I’ve done it. ;-)

    The thing is, no actual sex was involved (it was high school), and this guy was one of my closest male friends (I’ve known him since like 1st grade), and oddly, not really my type (he has blonde hair, blue eyes). There was no big fallout from it (though he was interested in me at various points in time), but I do think I came out on top as the disinterested one (and the one who’s been in multiple serious relationships). Overall, my story’s pretty tame, but it probably would’ve been different if I were older (or more adventurous).

  22. Oh the fascination of women’s inner-worlds, like a metaphorical peek into the girl’s shower during high school gym, haha.

    I have to give some props to Nkosazana’s husband for waiting MONTHS to, ahem… well, y’know. Personally, if that were me, I’d have started wondering after a few weeks whether the girl I was dating was attracted to me or not. (However, I did de facto wait months before I got to even meet Jasmin, so who am I to say in the end, huh?)

    I’ve never personally done FWB either, but I have had a fair amount of experience in the dating scene post-college that has led to me a pretty cynical view of casual sex. (Yes, I was one of the few guys who actually got used by women until my lovely girlfriend came and saved me… Hehe.) That said, I’m still liberal about it, and think casual sex in the context of a serious relationship/serious dating relationship is normal and/or expected. Especially as you get older. But maybe that’s because I tend to move fast. (Jasmin thinks I’m the patient one, but that’s only because she’s just really impatient!)

    As for one-night stands… Bleh. Been there, done that. Didn’t like it. Unless your banging a supermodel or one of those guys from Abercrombie & Fitch advertisements, they’re really just empty exercise in my opinion. Plus, unless you’re fairly closed-off emotionally, the whole experience can be nerve-wracking if you’re concerned about how you might look to the other person.

    Oy vey, this whole conversation has got me all long-winded. I’ll just leave off with that FWB in my experience with people who’ve done it are doomed to failure because people always have conflicting expectations and interpretations of the situation.

  23. Zek,

    I can understand why a guy might be interested in this post!

    PS- I am more than interested in learning what guys think about one night stands… Care to share your views with us? (In a form of a guest post or something). I am quite intrigued about this whole mess… thing.

  24. Personally, if that were me, I’d have started wondering after a few weeks whether the girl I was dating was attracted to me or not.

    I understand you. To tell you the truth, it is how it goes sometimes, but woman waiting to have sex is usually not a sign of disinterest. However, I could never understand that behaviour. I can’t wait long, lol.

    Unless your banging a supermodel or one of those guys from Abercrombie & Fitch advertisements, they’re really just empty exercise in my opinion.

    Bainging a supermodel or a guy from that ad migh (might!) give you an ego boost, but it still doesn’t guarantee any physical satisfaction. I don’t know about supermodels, but I know uber hot guys rarely try (because they’re soooooooo hot and everybody wants them) so they’re a lazy f..k.

  25. “Hiya! Alee, I like your site.”

    Hi Eugenia, thanks. :)

    “Really as people we can really be imaginative so they may be really hyping up the ‘possible’ relationship…”

    Lol. Indeed. Very imaginative.

    “And yes at least with a one nighter you can always pretend but investing weeks or months in an FWB it’s hard to pretend like that happened, even harder to pretend that it don’t hurt.”

    Yes, it might not be as “good”, but at least you won’t have to go through the extra burden later on. I guess it’s a trade-off.

  26. Jasmin,

    “I guess I get to be the expert here–I’ve done it. ;)”

    Ha!

    “The thing is, no actual sex was involved”

    Then it doesn’t count. :P

    Just kidding. Did you plan it or did it just happen?

  27. zek,

    “Personally, if that were me, I’d have started wondering after a few weeks whether the girl I was dating was attracted to me or not.”

    A few weeks? What?

    I’ll just answer Nkosazana’s question a bit and say I wait for much longer than a few weeks. A few weeks is like a few hours or maybe even a few minutes, in my book. But that helps to separate the wheat from the chaff. ;)

    “Personally, if that were me, I’d have started wondering after a few weeks whether the girl I was dating was attracted to me or not. “

    I agree with Mira that it isn’t a sign of disinterest. For many women, it’s to make sure that it’s (a) the right thing to do at that point in time and (b) to know if you’re really interested in a relationship with them or just “scoring” with them.

    “Yes, I was one of the few guys who actually got used by women until my lovely girlfriend came and saved me… Hehe.”

    Oh, how awful.
    I do always get “protect him” feelings about you. You seem way too nice.

    “I…think casual sex in the context of a serious relationship/serious dating relationship is normal and/or expected.”

    What? Doesn’t anyone wait until marriage anymore?

    ROTFL.

    “Oy vey, this whole conversation has got me all long-winded.”

    More wind! More wind!

    I would be open to a guest post as Mira suggested, if you have a lot to say on the topic.

  28. What? Doesn’t anyone wait until marriage anymore?

    Americans… ;)

    Seriously, now. Premarital sex is norm in my culture. I don’t know anybody who waits till marriage, even people who have only one partner their whole life.

    But I guess the sentiment goes along the lines of: how can you marry someone you never had sex with? It’s like marrying someone you’ve never met. It’s just seen as… Weird. You can’t do that.

    There might be some people who wait till marriage, but I sure don’t know anybody. Not just my generation and younger: it goes for my parents generation, and even grandparents. (Though my grandmother did say waiting till marriage was somewhat important, and that it was the main reason why girls married at a young age- who could wait till they’re 25? <- Her words, not mine).

  29. Mira,

    “Americans…”

    Lol. It’s not just Americans (actually, most Americans don’t wait *around 97% hadn’t in the early 2000s; it’s probably more now*, so I don’t think it’s an American thing). But it’s certainly still the case in more traditional countries and places.

    “But I guess the sentiment goes along the lines of: how can you marry someone you never had sex with?”

    I mean, if you put precedence on the physical act over other aspects of the relationship, then you wouldn’t. But some people don’t, and don’t consider it mandatory to truly “know” a person. They figure that even if their partner isn’t “good”, they can learn with them.

    “who could wait till they’re 25?”

    I can wait a long time — years. If there is no one that I feel is worthy, then why jump into it?

    Plus, I think a part of why people want it so much is because they’ve already been physical. When you’ve never tried it, you don’t know what you’re missing. ;)

  30. I can wait a long time — years.

    Dear lord! I’ve had dry-spells like that, but I wouldn’t voluntarily do it! Maybe that’s just my personal libido, but that seems way too long to go without getting lucky. Haha, are you actually human Alee?? ; )

    A few weeks? What?

    YES! Like 3 or 4 — tops. That’s probably at least 5 or 6 dates, plus hangouts and such. I mean, that’s a lot of getting to know someone to me. If they’re not attracted or into me enough by then, then maybe they’re never going to be. Or maybe let me put it like this: I’m a pretty fast-mover, and I’m very upfront and honest/blunt, so when I like a girl I’m ready to GO. Jump into a relationship, y’know? And for me a relationship (obviously) includes sex. And to me it makes sense that if a girl doesn’t want to sleep with me after so much time getting to know me, it would seem she’s also not attracted to me as a person either. And if that’s the case, then why bother making all the effort to convince her of something that she’s not feeling?

    Also, I agree with Mira that extremely hot people tend to be very bad in bed because they think their hotness counts as skill. Not based on personal experience, but based on what people have told me.

    I’d be open to doing a guest-post on one-night stands from a guy’s perspective sometime in the future! Just let me run it by the GF, see what details she’d rather I didn’t put in ; )

  31. Zek,

    I’ve had dry-spells like that, but I wouldn’t voluntarily do it!

    Same here. I don’t think I could do that voluntarily, especially if I’m around a guy that I’m attracted to. You see, what I said about a woman’s “no” (that usually doesn’t mean she’s not interested) doesn’t really apply to me. If I’m interested, I make my interest known.

    I guess I just can’t be in a relationship without sex, and I don’t think I can be in a relationship with someone I’m not truly attracted to, both mentally and, yes, physically. In fact, before I was mature enough to have sex I wasn’t dating at all… I wasn’t interested in boys at all. And then- bum! Just like that.

    And yes, it’s not the best tactic a woman can do, because of the double standard and all. (You can get labeled slut pretty fast).

    Luckily, I am not considered particularly attractive, and I can’t flirt at all, so I didn’t really have much chance to do all this in practice (my reputation is, more or less, intact :D). But I’d lie if I said it’s because I was careful… I wasn’t. I just don’t know how to behave in these situations.

    YES! Like 3 or 4 — tops. That’s probably at least 5 or 6 dates, plus hangouts and such.

    Well, I really don’t like to count dates. It all depends on the person, the mood, etc.

    But let’s just say my husband and I started living together 2-3 weeks after we’ve met. (Well, technically, 2-3 weeks after our first date). So… yeah.

    As for the One night stand from male POV, I wasn’t asking for your personal experience (though it sure helps). You don’t have to include any personal info.

    I just wanted a guy’s answer to my “Women and casual sex” post.

    http://jefflion.net/archives/405

  32. Alee,

    Lol. It’s not just Americans
    I know. I was just joking. But I did notice Americans mention it much more than people in my culture (who don’t mention it at all).

    (actually, most Americans don’t wait *around 97% hadn’t in the early 2000s; it’s probably more now*, so I don’t think it’s an American thing).

    I think it has to be one of those differences (pretty known in anthropology) between an ideal and real life. There’s this (moral) ideal and imperative, and people claim to follow it… But real life shows something different.

    Still, it’s not difficult to find Americans talking about it (abstinence till marriage); and this sort of thinking is pretty rare in western cultures.

    But it’s certainly still the case in more traditional countries and places.

    Of course there are. I guess some Middle Eastern countries? Not sure, but I know USA can hardly be a perfect example of it. Still, people DO talk a lot about it, imo.

    My culture considers itself to be traditional, and yet, nobody even talks about it. Premarital sex is taken for granted. It’s just another example of ideal vs reality: we like to think we’re traditional (because it proves how ancient and important we are), but in reality… not really. (Not in a way we claim to be).

    I mean, if you put precedence on the physical act over other aspects of the relationship, then you wouldn’t. But some people don’t, and don’t consider it mandatory to truly “know” a person. They figure that even if their partner isn’t “good”, they can learn with them.

    Oh yes, I understand that. I’m just saying culture plays a significant role here. There are some people who wait till marriage in my culture (I guess), but the point is, we’re all made to see premarital sex as norm. Now, when, how, what, how many partners- it’s all culturally defined and there are many differences between males and females.

    I don’t know about the US, but the “ideal” situation for a guy is to be a girl’s second lover: she is experienced, but not TOO experienced (which is a HUGE no-no). That’s why it’s a common lie girls tell: “you’re my second”. Riiight. In any case, even if you end up marrying your first lover, you’ll have sex before the marriage. We are simply made to see it as the way things just are… (And ironically, part of this mindset is taken from the American movies and TV shows… I’m not kidding).

    I can wait a long time — years. If there is no one that I feel is worthy, then why jump into it?

    Well, good for you. But not everybody can do it. Some people don’t really feel a particular sexual drive unless there’s a particular individual they want to be with.

    When you’ve never tried it, you don’t know what you’re missing. ;)

    Could be… But (without getting way too much TMI), I think I was thinking about sex more when I was a virgin. Sometimes it was the only thing I could think of. (Ok, not really, but you get the idea). I idealized the whole thing. I thought it’s so powerful, the passion, the touch… everything. Then you realize many young people do it not because of love and/or passion but because they’re bored, or to feel more mature. And you’re like…. WTF?

  33. After my divorce, I felt like indulging in all those behovioural patterns I wasn’t able to do because I got married so young(not that I regret it, mind you), so I’ve had a friend with benefits relationship, or so I thought. He was of the opinion we were exclusive and serious. Miscommunication?. No, he as a male(my opinion) just couldn’t fathom that I didn’t want more than sex with him and that whenever he/I wanted without getting all emotionally involved. He terrorised me to the point I had to call the police, who were extremely supportive, even though this guy was 12yrs younger than I!!!!!. Never again. Don’t judge me ladies, but I have been married, regret my divorce grant you now that I’ve had lots of time to see what an awesome guy I had (but will NEVER let him know) am having fun flirting, teasing and if I do feel like it and the physical connection is there, sexing some hot blonde young’uns. I’m extremely direct with men, which seems to turn off most guys my age, but not the younger ones, hence why I do end up getting to know them and actually becoming friends WITHOUT (sexual) benefits.
    I’m not a fan of FWBs, would rather the one nighter (without alcohol) to tell the truth, but I know for most women that’s not very satisfying as the physical gratification is tied into how well we know that male……..

  34. I know for most women that’s not very satisfying as the physical gratification is tied into how well we know that male……..

    I am not sure if it’s about how well we know that male, or how well he knows us. Let’s face it, ladies: a guy can enjoy (more or less) even a crappy sex where a girl doesn’t try much. It’s different for (most) women. They can’t enjoy unless a guy invests some time and energy and… stuff. And most guys won’t even try to do that in one night stand. So you get crappy sex, and the only true gratification is, maybe, the rush and feeling of excitement and/or feeling that you are in the control of your sexuality (many women feel they are not in full control of their sexuality, which is sad).

  35. “(many women feel they are not in full control of their sexuality, which is sad)”.

    Good point there, Mira. I just I’m one of the few who does. Although I love men and have some really great male friends, I see a male I’m physically attracted to, for lack of a better term and please erase this Alee if you find it offensive, “walking fuck sticks” to hop on, take what I want and say, auf wiedersehen after I’ve taken my pleasure. Perhaps this mindset came from my having been married to my first, who taught me a lot about pleasure, not having gone through any “disappointments” with men and having zero expectations and certainly being older not wanting any committments……

  36. Foosrock, not judging you or anything, but don’t it get very lonely living like that? (Don’t get me wrong I’m all for grown ass people doing whatever they want, I’m very liberal when it comes to that as long as you don’t hurt other people then I’m fine with it)

    I mean don’t you miss having a man to wake up with every morning and just do stuff with? I’ve been married a couple of years now and I don’t know if I could see myself without my family and the routine that I like so much ..

  37. Hiiiiiii Nkosazana ,
    “I mean don’t you miss having a man to wake up with every morning and just do stuff with?”
    Noooooo. I honestly wish though I could do that, and have even tried somewhat, in the form of having a roommate (rented out a room in my home to an expat on a short term contract), it drove me bonkers. I winged at every little thing and he irritated me to the point of me kicking him out after 4wks of torture of sharing my valuable space. The guy was ok for the most part, I just don’t like sharing. My son’s the only person I share my space with and believe me, after a weekend, can’t wait until he goes back to his Dad’s. I know it’s not the same as what you asked, but I surmise from this experience alone, that I’m not capable or ready for such a big change of having someone “wake up next to me”. In fact sounds rather scary and I gag at the thought. Food for thought: met my ex at 18yrs, married with 23, divorced after 16yrs. Am single since 8yrs and it will take someone just as special as my ex to make we want that “routine” you mentioned. Haven’t met him yet, although I’ve known some really really nice men. Probably committment phobic. I don’t analyse it. Nature will work it out I believe………

  38. I think woman being in control with her sexuality means exactly that… to really know what she wants, when, where, how and with whom – as well as knowing what she doesn’t want.

    For some women, it means having one nights stands without feeling guilty about it or caring about the double standards. For other women, it means not having sex at all until the right guy shows up.

    But in any case, I think women should sit down and think about this. We all need to understand ourselves, our bodies, our needs and expectations and we all need to take control. We should not let society, or men, tell us what to do (or don’t do) with our sexuality.

  39. … Or other women, for that matter. Like I already said elsewhere, women can be a woman’s worst enemies. Many women support “virgin vs whore” mentality, which is not a good thing. I think it’s important to support women who make different (sexual) choices than we do (be it about sexual behavior, sexual orientation, etc.) because it’s the only fair thing to do and it helps us all in the long run.

  40. zek,

    “Maybe that’s just my personal libido, but that seems way too long to go without getting lucky. Haha, are you actually human Alee?? ; )”

    Why no, I’m not. :) I’m actually a goddess sent to earth…

    Seriously, for me, any intimate act is completely intertwined with how I feel about a person. If there is no one that I love, or I haven’t reached the point where I love the person I’m with, I wouldn’t have sex just for its sake.

    But don’t get that confused with libido: the only complaints I get in that area is “too much/too often”. ;) As long as I love the person, it’s all fine.

    “And to me it makes sense that if a girl doesn’t want to sleep with me after so much time getting to know me, it would seem she’s also not attracted to me as a person either.”

    But it doesn’t necessarily follow that if someone doesn’t want to be intimate with you (yet), that she’s not attracted to you. There are countless reasons she could be waiting, a few of which I listed above.

  41. Mira,

    “Luckily, I am not considered particularly attractive”

    You’re cute! That’s probably why: people think you’re too young, so they can’t consider you “sexy” or they’d feel weird. :)

    “I guess some Middle Eastern countries?”

    And African… there are pockets of more traditional places here as well. The South is more traditional than the North, I’d say. A lot of it has to do with religion and church.

    “Well, good for you.”

    Hey, don’t “good for you” me! :)

    I don’t think there is any “right” way to approach these things… I have no problem with FWBs, I just don’t think it would work for me. I’m too much of a romantic for it.

    You’re right that virgins think about intimacy a lot, but they’re clearly not dying to do it, since they’re (still) virgins. ;)

  42. foosrock,

    “I’ve had a friend with benefits relationship, or so I thought. He was of the opinion we were exclusive and serious. Miscommunication?. No, he as a male(my opinion) just couldn’t fathom that I didn’t want more than sex with him”

    Yes, this definitely happens. I’ve had that happen (not with sex), but when I am only physically attracted to a guy, but not mentally or emotionally attracted, but he presumes I like him more than that. But yes, it goes back to people having different expectations for the arrangement.

    “am having fun flirting, teasing and if I do feel like it and the physical connection is there, sexing some hot blonde young’uns.”

    LOL.

    “please erase this Alee if you find it offensive”

    And have people miss your hilarious comments? I don’t think so. :)

    And this comment is a perfect example of extreme avoidant attachment (and Nkosazana’s of secure attachment). Thanks — real life examples are always the best. ;)

  43. “And this comment is a perfect example of extreme avoidant attachment (and Nkosazana’s of secure attachment). Thanks — real life examples are always the best”.

    Oh goodness, I went for a jog, was thinking of my comment and the last blog on avoidant and came back to say exactly that. Thanks. I like knowing more about myself. Your blog is extremely informative and fun. What a spagat!!!!

  44. You’re cute! That’s probably why: people think you’re too young, so they can’t consider you “sexy” or they’d feel weird. :)

    Could be, could be. :P But I think I never understood the importance of fashion and the way it can make you feminine, classy or sexy. I just don’t pay attention on these things… And then I get confused when people don’t see me the way I see myself.

    Hey, don’t “good for you” me! :)

    I am sorry, I didn’t want to sound patronizing or disrespectful… When I meant to say is, it’s good to know what works for you.

    I don’t think there is any “right” way to approach these things… I have no problem with FWBs, I just don’t think it would work for me. I’m too much of a romantic for it.

    The funny thing is, so am I. While I can separate sex and love in theory, it seems to be impossible for me not to fall in love with a guy after I have sex with him. (Though not necessarily before).

    You’re right that virgins think about intimacy a lot, but they’re clearly not dying to do it, since they’re (still) virgins. ;)

    Virginity is not always a choice. Some people want to lose it as soon as possible, but are unable to find a partner. These people are often males, since societal pressure is strong on them, and plus, it’s somewhat easier for a girl to find a sex partner (as long as it’s just for sex) than for a guy. But it does happen to girls, too.

  45. Mira,

    “Virginity is not always a choice. Some people want to lose it as soon as possible, but are unable to find a partner….These people are often males”

    Lol, I was thinking before I read the last part, “they must be male”. :P

    If you’re a woman, I don’t think it’s difficult to be intimate with someone, if you choose. Even if you’re not considered attractive (although I think if you’re obese, you’ll have more trouble). But for men, yes, it’s harder… still, I know several men that lost it to women who only slept with them for stuff (money, attention, etc) or prostitutes. Or the basically FWBs, “pity” deal.

  46. Mira, forgot to reply to this:

    “it seems to be impossible for me not to fall in love with a guy after I have sex with him. (Though not necessarily before).”

    So you wouldn’t be open to FWBs? Just making sure.

  47. Ooooooooo, Mira make an interesting point I’d love for you, Alee to blog about: Why so many women fall in love with men after having sex. It boggles my mind and I’ve had many “falling out” with female friends who were offended by my lack of tact when voicing my incredibility at this “phenomenon”.

  48. foosrock, interesting: I may write about that in the future. But it would be loooonnnng, and maybe have to be broken up into a series of posts.

  49. No shes going to write about equality in marriages first! ;)

    I know several men that lost it to women who only slept with them for stuff (money, attention, etc) or prostitutes

    What kind of men are you hanging around with anyway? lol.

    All this talk of virginity makes me dread the day when my little girl hits 14 and the boys comes sniffing around.

  50. So you wouldn’t be open to FWBs? Just making sure.

    I think, rationally – and knowing myself – it’s really not for me. There’s no way it would work. Never. I’d fall in love with a guy pretty quickly (and chances are that he wouldn’t feel the same, especially if the deal starts as casual sex).

    That being said, I have to be completely honest with myself and admit I am not sure if I’d be able to think rationally in certain circumstances. If I had a ready & available male friend in those 3 years when I was single, I’d sure slip in FWB situation quickly. I think. But it wouldn’t end up well.

    foosrock!
    Why so many women fall in love with men after having sex.

    Actually, in my experience, it happens to men, too. I was a bit surprised to learn it, especially after all the talk about guys who want sex only, guys who push girls into having sex with them (promising they’ll get attached). I used to believe it’s a myth. But it happens. It looks like sex can make people attached to each other.

  51. And I’d love to see a post on this, btw. To be honest, I don’t know why it’s happening (falling in love after sex). I really don’t know. I used to believe it’s just me, because I don’t need love to have sex. (What I’m saying is, being in love with a guy was never required for me to have sex or to consider having sex with a guy).

  52. Nkosazana,

    “No shes going to write about equality in marriages first! ;)”

    Seriously! I have a whole list of topics that I’ve promised to write about. (And I don’t even have enough time to write them…) In due time, my friends, in due time.

    “What kind of men are you hanging around with anyway? lol.”

    Athletic types, mostly. I was the woman who was best friends with all the jocks in high school and college.

    Mira,

    “To be honest, I don’t know why it’s happening (falling in love after sex). I really don’t know. I used to believe it’s just me, because I don’t need love to have sex.”

    I think there are several reasons why it happens. And yes, I don’t think it’s limited to women, although men are socialized in a way that results in them being more casual with these affairs.

  53. Ooh, good topic.

    I did this in the past. Probably am about 9 years removed from it. Why did I do it? Well, I spent my life as the so-called good girl and I wanted to be a little uninhibited. Of course, my uninhibited years were still extremely tame compared to most, but it was out of character for me.

    The one reason I considered this was because I knew that during a certain period of time, I was not going to be putting down roots in any particular location. So I didn’t mind having a summer fling or a short-term romance with a guy… I think that’s what made the difference, the idea that the FWB situation would have to end because I’d be moving or he’d be moving and then I wouldn’t have to worry about it. I would never have considered FWB with someone who was going to be around indefinitely.

    Anyway, after my 3-year “wild” period (ha ha), I found FWBs to be ultimately unsatisfying. If I couldn’t have sex in a committed relationship, I didn’t want it. So I took a long break… like Alee alluded to… and it honestly was just fine.

    When I met my husband, I made him wait about four months. He jokes about it, but he ultimately understood and actually liked the fact that I stuck to my guns.

  54. Bunny,

    Interesting story. Classic “good girl gone bad.” ;)

    “I think that’s what made the difference, the idea that the FWB situation would have to end because I’d be moving or he’d be moving and then I wouldn’t have to worry about it. I would never have considered FWB with someone who was going to be around indefinitely.”

    It would certainly make FWBs more bearable; know that either of you wouldn’t be around eventually. If only all FWBs had that guarantee…

    “When I met my husband, I made him wait about four months. He jokes about it, but he ultimately understood and actually liked the fact that I stuck to my guns.”

    Now that’s a man.

    [zek, take note ;) ]

  55. It would certainly make FWBs more bearable; know that either of you wouldn’t be around eventually. If only all FWBs had that guarantee…

    See, even in my supposed wild phase, I was still trying to be cautious and control the situation. LOL It was so much easier to pick someone who had a definite exit date, which meant that any FWB relationship would come to an end at a designated time. I think that even then, I was well aware that an FWB was not an ideal situation, but it worked for me at the time. And that was a time in which I was moving to a new location almost every year and not being quite sure of where I wanted to end up. An actual relationship was not desirable to me at the time because it would have limited my freedom and my plan at the time, but uh, a girl still had needs. ;)

    I still ran into some problems though. In one case, the guy fell in love and I couldn’t wait to get out of there. In another case, the guy suddenly backed out of the deal and I felt rejected and more hurt/upset than I thought!

    And I admit… it’s funny to me how folks swear they can’t last longer than three weeks without sex. Maybe years might be problematic (although I’ve gone years and been just fine with it), but weeks without sex? Or months?

    Y’all will live. :)

  56. Bunny,

    “See, even in my supposed wild phase, I was still trying to be cautious and control the situation. LOL”

    Lol. Yes you were. Smart woman. If you know what you’re doing you can lessen the blowback of a FWBs gone wrong.

    “And I admit… it’s funny to me how folks swear they can’t last longer than three weeks without sex. Maybe years might be problematic (although I’ve gone years and been just fine with it), but weeks without sex? Or months?”

    Years ain’t nothin’! ;)

    It definitely depends on the person, age, and experience… And their ability/desire to use their own “equipment” in the meantime. :D

  57. Girls, You are all making me feel like a prude here. Seeing how I had zero experience before my husband.

    I kinda felt safe until Alee mention her involvement with the football team :D.

  58. ability/desire to use their own “equipment” in the meantime. :D

    Yup. :D

    And I admit… it’s funny to me how folks swear they can’t last longer than three weeks without sex.

    Indeed. It’s ridiculous.

  59. Nkosazana,

    “Girls, You are all making me feel like a prude here. Seeing how I had zero experience before my husband.”

    Nothing wrong with that! Nothing wrong at all. That’s a good thing, in fact.

    I don’t want to make it seem as if I have a long list of men, because I don’t.

    “I kinda felt safe until Alee mention her involvement with the football team :D .”

    *dead*

    I was not involved with the football team in that manner! I was just close friends with a lot of them. Nothing more than platonic interest (at least not on my part).

  60. Nothing wrong with that! Nothing wrong at all. That’s a good thing, in fact.

    Well it’s not out of prudishness really, I just did not find a person I liked/loved enough to sleep with. I find it sex to be a very intimate thing and not something I just do for fun (well I do now with hubby but I love him so..)

    I was not involved with the football team in that manner!

    I’m just messing with you ;)

  61. Nkosazana,

    “Well it’s not out of prudishness really, I just did not find a person I liked/loved enough to sleep with. I find it sex to be a very intimate thing and not something I just do for fun”

    And that’s completely fine; I’m the same way. Even if you were a prude: who cares? People should do what they are comfortable with and inclined to, without having to feel pressured or worried about what others might think of them, either way.

    “I’m just messing with you”

    Just clearing the air! :)

  62. People should do what they are comfortable with and inclined to, without having to feel pressured or worried about what others might think of them, either way.

    I agree. These things are highly intimate and personal. You don’t want others to dictate what to think or how to feel, or what to do. What works for them might not work for you (and there’s nothing wrong with that!)

    Like I said, I think people (especially female people) should support each other when it comes to this, instead of getting into the “whores vs virgins” battle. (I’m not saying anybody here was into that, but I think it’s important to mention it anyway). As long as women hate on each other for different sexual choices/behavior, they will have problems with this ugly thing called double standard (and other forms of sexism).

    Women should really think twice before judging other women who have had more (or less, or different kind of) sexual experience than them.

    So, Nkosazana, I don’t think you have anything to be ashamed of, especially given the fact you find what you’re looking for and seem very happy! :)

    Nothing wrong with that! Nothing wrong at all. That’s a good thing, in fact.

    What’s a good thing? Not having any experience before the husband?

  63. Mira,

    ‘I think people (especially female people) should support each other when it comes to this, instead of getting into the “whores vs virgins” battle.’

    ITA. But to be honest, it barely makes a blip on my radar if a woman has had zero experience, or if she has so many she can’t even remember them. I just don’t consider it at all, but women seem to be afraid to talk about their experiences around me because they assume I’m conservative and will judge them.

    With men, I do take into account their experiences, if I’m romantically interested in them. Can’t help it.

    “What’s a good thing? Not having any experience before the husband?”

    Yes, because she’s never struck me as the type to feel comfortable with a casual physical relationship, so it’s good that she didn’t just jump into things. Now, if it were someone like foosrock, it’d probably be not such a good thing… :)

  64. But to be honest, it barely makes a blip on my radar if a woman has had zero experience, or if she has so many she can’t even remember them.

    Don’t get me wrong, I am not interested in other people’s personal lives. I was talking about the principle.

    Now, I don’t know about the US, but people here don’t know how to mind their own business, and things like this are often discussed. It’s not strange to hear in a conversation that a girl is a “whore”, for example. I mean, this information will be passed as her defining characteristic. Guys will use this info to try to have sex with her, and girls will try to gain points for their better moral behavior based on her.

    To be honest, I don’t get to hear much of an opposite situation – someone being ridiculed for the lack of experience – if they’re female (in fact, many women lie about it and claim they’re not particularly experienced), but I do have a few friends who are virgins in their 20s and they sometimes feel strange about it. And I don’t think anybody should feel ashamed of their sexual experience, or lack thereof.

    I just don’t consider it at all, but women seem to be afraid to talk about their experiences around me because they assume I’m conservative and will judge them.

    Really? But you seem quite open-minded. At least online. :)

    But it’s true many women lie about their experience (such as number of partners) in order not to lose respect. Guys do it, too, but they try to appear more experienced than they really are.

    Yes, because she’s never struck me as the type to feel comfortable with a casual physical relationship, so it’s good that she didn’t just jump into things. Now, if it were someone like foosrock, it’d probably be not such a good thing… :)

    I agree. So many people make this mistake of going with what society, or people around them want them to do, instead of doing what it feels right FOR THEM.

  65. Mira,

    “I don’t know about the US, but people here don’t know how to mind their own business, and things like this are often discussed.”

    Oh, that applies here too. :)

    Yuck at that “whore” stuff. That sounds very high school or guys’ locker room-ish. I don’t think many women here would say that so bluntly in public about another woman, unless she is spoiling for a fight.

    “To be honest, I don’t get to hear much of an opposite situation – someone being ridiculed for the lack of experience – if they’re female”

    Yes, it generally happens less often if you’re a woman. But it depends on your social circles. In my very liberal circles, it’s not uncommon for people to say bad things about a woman who has chosen to wait for marriage, for example. They call them stupid, prude, etc.

    “Really? But you seem quite open-minded. At least online. :)”

    I’m open-minded in my own way. But I guess I give off “goody two-shoes/ms. perfect” vibes. And I have no problem saying that, for myself personally, I wouldn’t do things like FWBs, wouldn’t do drugs, etc. So because of that, people think I’m saying I look down on those things in general.

  66. Yuck at that “whore” stuff. That sounds very high school or guys’ locker room-ish. I don’t think many women here would say that so bluntly in public about another woman, unless she is spoiling for a fight.

    Hmmm… Maybe I used the wrong word. But it’s definitely a common slang term for promiscuous woman: whore, slut… whatever. And yes, the same word is used by 16 year old boys and grown up women. Even women don’t shy away from calling other women those names! (Some are quite happy to put a label on them).

    In my very liberal circles, it’s not uncommon for people to say bad things about a woman who has chosen not to wait for marriage, for example.

    You mean, “who has chosen to wait for marriage”?

    So because of that, people think I’m saying I look down on those things in general.

    Well, quite often, people ARE unable to respect other people’s choices if they are different than their own. But you don’t seem like such a person.

  67. I’ve been missing all of the conversation (for good reason, of course). :-)

    While we’re sharing, Z’s the only person I’ve ever had sex with, and I don’t mind it. And I didn’t have sex for the first time until I was in my 20s. I’ve had a few serious boyfriends though, so I know people assume, and I know my friends who haven’t been in serious relationships sometimes feel awkward about it, like they don’t even have any prospects.

    In high school, I generally remember girls calling other girls whores out of jealousy, but I’m a softie and I tended to feel bad for girls who felt like they had to put out, since guys at school would treat them so badly. I was actually pretty good friends with a girl who was considered a whore in high school, and I always thought she was really sweet and deserved better than the guys who would do stuff with her in private than scorn her in public.

  68. And I didn’t have sex for the first time until I was in my 20s.

    Nothing wrong about that! (But I’m sure you already know this). Much better than rushing into it just for the sake of it.

    On the other hand, I’m definitely not against having sex in high school, if a person is ready.

    so I know people assume

    Oh yes, people and their inability to mind their own business!

    In high school, I generally remember girls calling other girls whores out of jealousy

    I don’t know about the high school, but general slut labeling is not much jealousy, I think: it’s about competition. Nothing throws a woman out of competition like a slut label. All she can get is sex, basically. So the other girls (“nice” ones) can get into serious relationships with guys (who’d never give “slut” a chance).

    I always thought she was really sweet and deserved better

    To be honest, most of the promiscuous girls I’ve met were really sweet girls. Sometimes, way too sweet an vulnerable. Makes me wonder if their lack of confidence is what made them sleep around. Which is a shame: while I don’t think it’s bad for a woman to have as many sexual partners as she wants, I do think it should be something she really wants – and not a desperate attempt for affection.

    Since we’re at it, I’ve been only with a few (very few) men, but the funny thing is, the way I look and dress, people assume my husband was my first boyfriend… And the way I talk about sex, they assume I’ve been with so many men I stopped counting after the 50th! ;)

    My problem was that how I felt about the issue and reality were not always compatible. I know this happens to guys more often than girls, but it wasn’t easy for me to find a guy (even just for sex)… I just can’t flirt and the way I look doesn’t really scream “I’m open to it!” I used to be very frustrated about it (I think I’ve had a brain of a teenage boy, not girl). You know, the “I’m going to die a virgin, oh no!” mentality.

    But now looking back at it, I think the fact guys didn’t pay much attention to me saved me a lot of trouble. First, I got to keep my reputation intact (and while I don’t really mind being called names, consequences can be extremely damaging for a woman in my culture who’s been labeled a slut), so it’s a good thing I avoided that. And another (more important), I avoided making some mistakes. After all, sex proved to be much different than I imagined it when I was 16, so it’s a good thing circumstances prevented me from hurting myself. At least I had some time to realize what I want and what I don’t want, what I need and what I don’t. (Especially in those 3 years after breaking up with my ex).

    PS- One more thing. (about sluts vs virgins) I must admit I’ve never had much respect for men who respect only “nice” girls and believe promiscuous (or what they think is promiscuous) women are trash. Like I said, I am considered a “nice” girl, but I’d never want to be with a guy like that. I didn’t want to be with somebody who’d respect me only if I withhold sex. That’s why I’m so happy my husband doesn’t buy into this slut vs virgin dichotomy. Hey, we started living together (if you know what I mean) after 2 or 3 weeks and he never treated me badly because of it (quite the contrary). I sure wouldn’t want to marry someone who’d think a woman has to wait for sex for months, or years to be worth a man’s attention.

  69. I must admit I’ve never had much respect for men who respect only “nice” girls and believe promiscuous (or what they think is promiscuous) women are trash.

    I don’t know, maybe its because we’re from different countries. But I kinda get it why men don’t want some women who sleeps around and I sure did not want a man with a list as long as the bible..

    Maybe it’s because I’ve seen what easy sex leads to in my country, the aids rate in my township alone is 20%. You can count people one two three four five! you got aids! and you would not be wrong. Condoms can break..

    But as I said, people can do as they please as long as it does not hurt me or my loved ones. I’m not judging. Heck I’m all for prostitution if a woman feels like it’s something she wants to do (I’ve talked to a danish prostitute and she seems happy enough, she pays taxes and all that. Heck she makes more money than me)

  70. I don’t know, maybe its because we’re from different countries

    I don’t think so. My country is very, very conservative when it comes to this.

    Premarital sex is a norm, yes, but a woman should not be promiscuous! It can seriously damage her social life, and other aspects of her life, too. Many men are womanizers and sleep around, but God forbid a girl does 10% of that! And you see, I don’t have any respect for that kind of men.

    What I’m saying is: I respect anybody’s sexual choice. If a girl decides to wait, good. If she decides to have only one guy in her life and to wait for months (years) to have sex with him, fine. If she choose to have a series of one night stands, fine. But my respect for her as a person doesn’t depend on it, and I have a zero respect for men who judge a woman based on her vagina! (in a way that a woman is good and worth of respect only if she didn’t let anybody inside it… before him, of course).

    No… Just, no.

    (Needless to say, most men in my culture are like this. Blah. )

  71. Mira,

    “Even women don’t shy away from calling other women those names! (Some are quite happy to put a label on them).’

    They do this in public? Or is it “girls gossip”, away from earshot? (If the latter, that happens here too.)

    ‘You mean, “who has chosen to wait for marriage”?’

    Yes, I did. Fixed.

    “Well, quite often, people ARE unable to respect other people’s choices if they are different than their own. But you don’t seem like such a person.”

    That’s true. And I won’t say that I don’t give the side-eye to some people’s choices, especially if they are harmful to themselves and/or other people. But for the most part, I’m an observer and I like that people are different and have their unique qualities that make life interesting.

  72. Jasmin,

    Oh, Z was your first (and only)? How cute. :)

    Early 20s is definitely not “late”, in my book, to lose your virginity. Not that there is anything wrong with losing it in your teenage years, but allowing yourself to mature and learn a bit before diving in is never a bad thing.

    Mira,

    “To be honest, most of the promiscuous girls I’ve met were really sweet girls. Sometimes, way too sweet an vulnerable. Makes me wonder if their lack of confidence is what made them sleep around.”

    This has been my experience too. They deeply crave affection.

    ‘I must admit I’ve never had much respect for men who respect only “nice” girls and believe promiscuous (or what they think is promiscuous) women are trash.’

    If they are going to think like that, they should at least apply the same standards to men. Which we all know doesn’t usually happen.

    I’ve dated men that thought that way though. One of my ex-boyfriends stated that he would be more hesitant to date a woman who had double digits, because he thought that meant they didn’t take the act as seriously as he did. And I could respect that, because it’s not like he had a huge number either.

  73. Early 20s is definitely not “late”, in my book, to lose your virginity.

    Indeed. Since when is early 20s “late”?!? Plus, in my experience, there are many, many people (both males and females) who lose it in their early 20s. But for some reason, this is rarely talked about, unless it’s for religious reasons and waiting. Guys seem to avoid this subject at all costs. But many do have their first sex in college. (Jim Morrison, anybody? :D)
    This has been my experience too. They deeply crave affection.

    This. And then there are those who believe they’re unattractive, so they see sex as the only way they can make men interested.

    If they are going to think like that, they should at least apply the same standards to men. Which we all know doesn’t usually happen.

    Usually? That NEVER happens, at least not here. As far as I understand, in the US, there’s this “true love waits” thing, or whatever is called, that urge both guys and girls to wait. Nothing of the sorts happen here. Double standards in all their ugliness. A guy has to be with many girls and to lose his virginity as soon as possible. Guys who wait do that because they can’t find a girl.

    would be more hesitant to date a woman who had double digits

    Wait, wait… DOUBLE DIGITS???? Alee, in my culture, even 4-5 is considered “way too many” for a woman. I think the acceptable number goes from 1 to 3. But not more than that, UNLESS you’ve had series of long term relationships (that lasted at least a few years). Only then. On the other hand, even 1 or 2 is considered too much if a woman didn’t wait to have sex.

  74. Mira,

    “there are many, many people (both males and females) who lose it in their early 20s. But for some reason, this is rarely talked about”

    Right. Many people are trying to look mature, liberal, and/or “experienced”. :)

    “This. And then there are those who believe they’re unattractive, so they see sex as the only way they can make men interested. “

    Yes… too bad this is a recipe for fail, in most cases.

    “Usually? That NEVER happens, at least not here.”

    I guess we can credit the Woman’s Movement for the fairness of some of our men. Some are not concerned at all about a woman’s number, as long as gigantic, like triple digits. In fact, some are not fond of virgins, because they don’t like that they will be inexperienced… Then of course there are those that love a woman with a lower, closer to or at zero, number.

    ‘As far as I understand, in the US, there’s this “true love waits” thing, or whatever is called, that urge both guys and girls to wait.’

    Lol, really? I haven’t noticed. Especially not with men. Some women think that way, though: they want to save themselves for that special guy.

    ‘Wait, wait… DOUBLE DIGITS???? Alee, in my culture, even 4-5 is considered “way too many” for a woman.’

    Yikes!

    Here, 4/5 would be expected, at least if the woman is past her early 20s. It’s definitely not “way too many”. Not exactly…

    “I think the acceptable number goes from 1 to 3.”

    1 to 3? How unreal… A guy here who preferred lower numbers would consider himself lucky if he found a woman who was past college age and had only been with 1 or 2 men. He’d consider her a definite catch.

  75. I don’t think early 20s is late either–most girls I’m friends with either did it in high school or haven’t done it yet, so I’m right in the middle. :-)

    There were guys who wanted to have sex with me before Z, but none I wanted to have sex with, so it was a simple decision really. :-P

    I’m the “live and let live” type with the caveat that you can only do that while accepting the consequences of your actions. I respect people more if they say, “Yea, I did it, and if you don’t like it, so what” instead of whining when the reaction they receive isn’t the one they were trying to evoke.

  76. Alee,
    Right. Many people are trying to look mature, liberal, and/or “experienced”. :)

    You see, that’s one thing I don’t get. You can’t force maturity. You can have sex at 14, but how mature is that? Also, experience: as we all (hopefully) know, you don’t get experience by sleeping around, especially when you’re not ready. A person who has sex with one partner 100 times is more experienced that the one who has sex with 100 people once. These things do require patience (something many teenagers don’t understand), and it’s one of the things why one night stands are not a perfect sexual arrangement, imo.

    I guess we can credit the Woman’s Movement for the fairness of some of our men.

    There are honest and fair guys in my culture, and those who respect women and are woman’s rights supporters. (I married one of those guys! ;) ). But they are outnumbered by those who embrace double standards in all their beauty. Plus, it’s not just the guys: many women, especially younger ones, buy into this double standards.

    In fact, some are not fond of virgins, because they don’t like that they will be inexperienced… Then of course there are those that love a woman with a lower, closer to or at zero, number.

    I think guys here prefer girls who’ve had 1 to 2, maybe 3 guys before them. It’s not like virgins are not respected (they are very respected in high school), but later in life… Not so sure. It’s not that guys dislike them being inexperienced, or because they don’t want to go through the process of taking someone’s virginity; it’s the belief surrounding virginity.

    Guys who are not interested in long term relationships don’t want virgins because they believe having sex would make these girls so attached to them that the break up would be difficult. They also hate the “I lost my virginity to you and now you owe me” girls.

    On the other hand, guys who are interested in long term relationship want a girl who knows what she wants. You see, guys here believe – and they have some reason to believe it – that you have more chance of being someone’s last if you weren’t her first. So they want to know a girl is really ready to settle down, if they are into it. They don’t want a girl to turn around after a few years and say: hey, I want to live a little, I want to know what is like to be with a different man.

    Here, 4/5 would be expected, at least if the woman is past her early 20s. It’s definitely not “way too many”. Not exactly…

    Well, to tell you the truth, I’m off the dating market for quite some time now, and I am not quite sure what is acceptable for a girl in her late 20s. But double digits is hardly acceptable and no woman would admit having 10 sexual partners. Maybe not even 7.

    1 to 3? How unreal… A guy here who preferred lower numbers would consider himself lucky if he found a woman who was past college age and had only been with 1 or 2 men. He’d consider her a definite catch.

    Well, the context is also important. Having 5 sexual partners is worse than having 2, but if it’s in context of long term relationships, then it’s acceptable. Much more acceptable than having one sexual partner but having sex with him after a week of relationship! Or even being a virgin but talking openly about sex (<- been there, done that)

  77. I don’t think early 20s is late either–most girls I’m friends with either did it in high school or haven’t done it yet, so I’m right in the middle. :-)

    I don’t have that many friends, but I’d say there are many of them who’ve lost in their early 20s… And that includes male friends, too! Definitely not the way I thought in high school! I thought that everybody had sex by the time they graduate (you graduate from high school at 19 here). Which wasn’t true, not at all. Not even for the guys.

    I’m the “live and let live” type with the caveat that you can only do that while accepting the consequences of your actions. I respect people more if they say, “Yea, I did it, and if you don’t like it, so what” instead of whining when the reaction they receive isn’t the one they were trying to evoke.

    People should not depend on others in this sense. If you depend on other people’s reaction, you won’t get far, because there will always be people who disagree with your choices.

    Also, I respect people who admit they’ve made mistakes, even if a mistake was a socially acceptable thing to do. A friend of mine regretted going to college, for example.

  78. ehm.. Wow. I know hubby has only been with 2 women before me and that was in long term relationships.. I see one of those once in a while, she has gotten fat, ugly and spawned a brood of equality fat and ugly kids.

    Urgh, Its annoying enough having to see that one ex once in a while but what if he has dated like 50 women…

  79. Well, to be honest, I would feel strange dating someone who’s been with 5o women before me. But I hate the double standards, that’s all.

  80. I agree. So many people make this mistake of going with what society, or people around them want them to do, instead of doing what it feels right FOR THEM.

    Yep, and I briefly fell into that trap. But I think I was able to be more confident about being sexually conservative after the brief crazy period… I think, with my personality, I had to experience a few FWBs to appreciate being a so-called prude. Otherwise, I would have felt that I was going with society’s standards in a different, yet still unfulfilling way — I didn’t like being placed in any kind of box (good girl, bad girl, etc.)… unless I had tried them both, I couldn’t really be me. Now I wave my sexual conservative flag proudly.

    Don’t know if that makes sense!

  81. I agree, Bunny, it makes complete sense. You might regard some of it as a mistake, maybe, but maybe it was just something you needed at a time. Remember, people learn from their mistakes and this way, you can be sure about what you truly want and what not.

    BTW, what does “not listening what others say/not doing what others want” mean in the American context when it comes to this issue? (Female sexuality)

    In my culture, it ALWAYS means being careful about sex, as if all the peer pressure is about having sex as soon as possible. Wrong. In reality, all a teenage girl hears is that she should NOT have sex, unless it’s within limited circumstances (= long term, loving relationship). They teach you that you have a full right to listen to yourself, no matter what others say, but ONLY if it means not having sex. Listening to yourself and deciding to have sex after three dates, no matter what others say is considered a huge no-no.

    In short, they all teach us how to say “no” (and I agree, it’s a valuable lesson indeed), but they teach us very little about how to say “yes”.

  82. Good points Mira. Everything happens for a reason! I definitely knew what I truly wanted by the time I reached age 25 and that was a very good thing.

    I’m also like you that I do wish that women felt more comfortable about saying yes — even if it’s only with the man they marry or plan to marry — instead of constantly hearing messages that say the only correct answer is no.

  83. Well, I see saying “yes” as taking charge and deciding what to do with your sexuality, even if you choose to say yes only to one guy, after you get married.

    On the other hand, I do think some guys need to learn how to say “no”. Contrary to the popular belief, casual sex, one nights stands, etc. can be harmful for a man. It’s something rarely talked about, but I’ve seen it. (That’s one of the reasons I’d love Zek to offer a male perspective on these issues).

  84. hi everyone.
    this is a really fascinating conversation.
    …”Why so many women fall in love with men after having sex. It boggles my mind and I’ve had many “falling out” with female friends who were offended by my lack of tact when voicing my incredibility at this “phenomenon”.”

    i found out that a lot of this reaction is because of hormones – orgasms lead to the production of oxytocin which makes women feel feelings of love and a need to be nurtured…so if someone gets you there then *allegedly* you are flooded by these feelings of tenderness toward that person.
    for men on the other hand, unless the feelings of tenderness are already there, getting there usually amkes him want to cut and run – hence the age-old issue of him not respecting you in the morning.
    i’m not a scientist but i have read a few articles on the subject as well as a few chick books, like this one which i really enjoyed: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Not-Tonight-Mr-Right-Girls/dp/0141019271/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top

    i dated my first serious boyfriend for 4 years before sleeping with him. i had never done it before and he had one previous partner. for me, it was a cultural and religious thing, waiting that is, and he was on board. we didn’t even do ‘everything else’ – we stopped at heated kissing. for four years. at times people convinced me that he was getting it elsewhere, but i have never had reason to believe he was, so i assume that he was getting in a lot of DIY, if the urge to do it really is that strong. we broke up for reasons that had nothing to do with sex.
    i firmly believe that people can wait, but i also believe that people can only wait if they want to, if the end goal is worth more to them than the gratification.

    my husband and i dated for 3 years before marrying and we didnt have sex till we were married. for me, i’d been in a couple of serious relationships that ended badly and i had no intention of adding another man -i grew up being told it was shameful to have more than one man on your list, since you’re supposed to wait till you marry, and therefore only ever sleep with one man.
    we had a long distance relationship till we married so i didnt want to worry if he was shagging someone else when he wasnt with me, so i just didnt have sex with him till we married. i figured if we broke up it would be easier to walk away if we’d never slept together.

    now, i’m a liberal when it comes to sexuality. i’m all for people enjoying themselves, and if you can handle it, go for it. i always caution my friends and family about the labels they might attract if they are seen to be enjoying themselves too much. it’s not practical to tell a girl who wants to marry not worry about what people think because the truth is that in our culture, people do care about reputations, it does matter.

    by the way, all my close friends are still virgins, and the youngest of them is 27. they are all christians by the way. none of them is willing to have sex outside of marriage for religious reasons mostly, and other reasons as well.

    wow, what a long comment. sorry :)

  85. Hi beautysdaughter :)

    I’ll be covering that whole postcoital attachment idea soon. I’m positive that hormones have to do with it, but it’s not the whole story by any means. And in my experience, like Mira, some men become attached afterwards as well.

    Good that you’ve decided to do what was comfortable for you. That’s the most important.

    No comments are long enough. ;)

  86. beautysdaughter,

    I agree that people CAN wait. The whole misconception behind this is that people can’t wait… Especially male people.

    it’s not practical to tell a girl who wants to marry not worry about what people think because the truth is that in our culture, people do care about reputations, it does matter.

    I don’t know what’s your culture, but I generally agree with this. Having a good reputation (in sexual sense) is considered very important for a woman. However, I don’t see it as more important as her overall well being (and repressing your sexuality because of societal norms is very harmful, imo). But if a woman choose to go this route, she should be ready to face the consequences. Going against socially acceptable behavior is sometimes the only way, but it’s a very hard way. Some people want to put themselves through it, others don’t. There’s nothing wrong either way.

    And in my experience, like Mira, some men become attached afterwards as well.

    Maybe it’s just me, and my circle of friends and acquaintances, but it’s definitely something I’ve observed. It’s not something that people often talk about (because it’s not socially acceptable for a guy to do this, especially if a girl in question is not a “nice” girl and a marriage material). But it happens more often than one would think. I’ve seen it happen, both personally and with my friends.

    One would say it’s not a true attachment but a male staying with a girl just because he can get sex. While this might be happening in some cases, true attachment is also present. It makes me believe there are no such great natural/hormonal differences between men and women, but cultural. Culturally, men are expected to do one thing, and women are expected to do another. Women are encouraged to make excuses for their sexuality (ok, I’ve slept with him after only three dates, but I actually love him), and men are encouraged to do the opposite (this slut is not worth my attention).

    But in any case, sex sometimes (not always, but more often than one might think) make people attached, and this is not limited to females only.

  87. Mira,

    “One would say it’s not a true attachment but a male staying with a girl just because he can get sex. While this might be happening in some cases, true attachment is also present.”

    Yes, in my experience, there is lots of true attachment. And what’s weird — it’s often that they become attached to the women who don’t get attached afterwards.

    “It makes me believe there are no such great natural/hormonal differences between men and women, but cultural.”

    There are general differences in specific hormonal levels, how and where these hormones are used, and which hormones are used. But these differences are greatly overestimated, IME. And the importance of societal expectations and culture are greatly underestimated.

  88. oh i wasn’t for a moment saying that men don’t get attached after sex – i know they do. i was just attempting to respond to the commenter who asked specifically about women.

    in the cases that i’ve noted where men get attached and the woman isn’t, it has usually though not always been the case that he already had romantic feelings for her that were unexpressed for whatever reason, and thought/believed/hoped that the sex would inevitably bring them together. i know it also happens that both of them go into it with no romantic feelings and the guy catches feelings, but i’m saying that *most* times he already had those feelings before hand.

    as for getting attached to people who DON”T want to be attached – i think a bit of ego comes into play. we all want to be desired …and what better ego-stroke is there than to actually make someone fall in love with you. people seem to think : if i just perform better in bed, or spend more money, or call more often then she/he won’t be able to help themselves…it defies common sense – surely everyone knows better than to chase after someone who clearly doesn’t want them -yet people of both sexes do it all the time, turning into borderline stalkers in the process. and in some cases, actual stalkers.
    or maybe that’s more common in my corner of the world :) this is just my take on it, it’s not something i’ve read up on or really considered extensively.

  89. I made my way to this site because I googled “How to maintain a FWB relationship.” This is a relevant topic to me because currently I have 1 booty call relationship, 1 sex buddy, 2-3 FWBs. I’m trying to make sure that I don’t end up emotionally stunted from these relationships, and so I’ve been scouring the internet looking for a manual on how to have healthy FWB relationships.
    However, many people would argue that ‘healthy’ and ‘FWB relationships’ are mutually exclusive. I guess the question is: Are they? I am not so sure, but currently I am in the middle of, perhaps the honeymoon stage of FWB, if you will, with these relationships and everything seems fine. After reading a few articles, it seems like the only place to go from here is down. I’m considering severing sexual ties with these men in order to avoid plummeting into destruction, but for some reason, I can’t bring myself to do it. Perhaps, I need to learn from my own mistakes? Or, better yet, perhaps I’m too dependent on their attention and too addicted to being desired?
    Although, in all honesty I’ve already ruined an amazing relationship because we had sex after 5 years of friendship. You think that experience would be enough?

  90. Hi Miss D,

    “currently I have 1 booty call relationship, 1 sex buddy, 2-3 FWBs.”

    That’s a lot to juggle isn’t it? :)

    “many people would argue that ‘healthy’ and ‘FWB relationships’ are mutually exclusive.”

    I don’t think it has to be, although some definitely can be unhealthy.

    “perhaps I’m too dependent on their attention and too addicted to being desired?”

    If you’re engaging in FWBs for attention or to feel desirable, then it’s probably unhealthy.

    If I were you, I would cut ties and figure out what I wanted. Do you really want to be in a committed relationship but you’re settling? Could you deal with the FWBs being ended without your choosing? Those are questions you could ask yourself.

  91. “That’s a lot to juggle isn’t it?”

    I guess that’s the nice part of FWB, or perhaps the whole point. It’s not something which I have to invest additional time in. There is no expected commitment of hangouts or attending events, dinners, etc. I don’t have to devote any attention to them, nor do they to me. One get to do their own thing, and enjoy the physical aspect of a sex, supposedly without the emotional ties and responsibilities that come with a full blown relationship.

    “If you’re engaging in FWBs for attention or to feel desirable, then it’s probably unhealthy.”

    I’m trying to be as objective about this as possible, and believing that I seek these types of relationships to fulfill some need of validation may be an unfortunate truth for me, as I’ve seen it multiple times throughout my college experience in other girls. If I sit back and ask myself, ‘What do I get out of these FWB relationships?’ Confidence and value from being desired probably tops the list. It’s not my main source of self-worth, but it does influence it, as do many things in our lives. Don’t get me wrong, I am an admirer of sex, and I enjoy it (Not addicted; as I can picture my life without it.). But let’s face it, I’m 23, and not all the guys in my age rage are rockstars in bed. Most of them are moderate, and some of them only receive a C for effort. I’m in it for the moments of passion and excitement; the romanticism that comes from being taboo and driven solely by desire. I love the way I feel during it, and I love how I make the guy feel. How I can boost his ego, and make him feel more secure with himself. However, as far as the actual and technical penetration goes, I’m indifferent. So, could it really be that the sex is my main motivator? Possibly not. And maybe, if women are honest about it, more of them would agree. What is your take on that?

    “Do you really want to be in a committed relationship but you’re settling? Could you deal with the FWBs being ended without your choosing? ”

    Fact: I do feel like I’m built for a committed relationship. I would enter one should the right man walk into my life. And here is another opinion I have: Doesn’t it make sense that most people involved in a FWB relationship would agree? Clearly, we are people that enjoy certain aspects of a relationship. In fact, we gravitate towards the one aspect that is reserved solely for romantic relationships. We love that part of a relationship so much, we are willing to incorporate it into relationships in which is traditionally does not belong. Sex changes the status of a relationship more than any other action. Doesn’t it make sense then, that we would desire a committed relationship in which the physical aspect is fundamentally included? We just haven’t found that person, and passing time with FWBs.
    Finally, yes. It would upset me if they ended it. Absolutely. I’ve been vulnerable and open with the boys, and it would feel like a rejection. Yet only a partial rejection and wouldn’t warrant a broken heart; I didn’t give them all of me, as I would in a committed relationship. This is also the reason why FWB’s are inherently unsatisfying emotionally, but they do fulfill hedonistic needs.

  92. Miss D,

    “One get to do their own thing, and enjoy the physical aspect of a sex, supposedly without the emotional ties and responsibilities that come with a full blown relationship.”

    …In theory. Not so much in practice, at least not for long.

    “So, could it really be that the sex is my main motivator? Possibly not. And maybe, if women are honest about it, more of them would agree. What is your take on that?”

    I do think some women would agree with that, although there are some that are probably more into the purely physical aspects.

    “Fact: I do feel like I’m built for a committed relationship. I would enter one should the right man walk into my life. And here is another opinion I have: Doesn’t it make sense that most people involved in a FWB relationship would agree?”

    No, it doesn’t, because that’s not what Friends With Benefits is about!
    :)

    On a serious note, I guess it makes sense that people involved in FWB appreciate commitment. But that’s why it’s so often a failure: if you want to be in a committed relationship, you should be in that. FWB is not a commitment, although it can seem like one if you’re (nearly) exclusively with one person. It’s easy, if you want commitment, to expect more from the FWB arrangement.

    “We just haven’t found that person, and passing time with FWBs.”

    Uh-oh. Sounds iffy. ;)

    “Finally, yes. It would upset me if they ended it. Absolutely. I’ve been vulnerable and open with the boys, and it would feel like a rejection.”

    Then you should probably end things before they do. Wait for a guy that you can commit to in ways besides the physical. Unless of course, you’re a masochist in addition to a hedonist, and like pain and rejection. :)

  93. It worked perfectly for me. We were both very physically attracted to each other but not very emotionally attached to each other. Also, neither of us where interested in relationships and were looking for a purely physical relationship.There were moments where we had emotional connections and we’d back away from each other LOL…kept things in check…we parted ways years ago and all I remember is the physical aspect.

    I definitely couldn’t do it now though, I’d go so far out of my way to establish an emotional connection…and either way i’m done having sex till marraige. Just a personal decision that is working out pretty well so far ;)

  94. df,

    If you’re not emotionally equipped for FWB anymore, that’s a good decision. You should always go with what works for you. :)

  95. i alwyas thouqht as lonqq as itz just FWB you cant qet emo attatched but i did…
    i did freinds FWB once with no feelinqqs attatched really(:
    then i met this quy and well i did it aqain…thi time i qot emo atatched, if i could qo back i would have never done it….but oh well,
    ummm it happen like this, i met this quy i didnt want a relationship he was cute, he liked me, he is and was a really qreat quy,one of those ‘qood’ quys.
    but i didnt want a realtionship with him if i new i still had stronqq freelinqs for my X it wouldnt have been fair to him :/ … i had a choise i qave myself-> keep it as a freind thinqq, qo out with him, or fwb… i chose FWB.
    we messed around a lil once, i should of stoped it then.
    because then after the second time we went more intiment…. &dont even talk anymore… that hurts alot.
    i think i quit FWB shit.

  96. I am in my first FWB relationship and I realized the hard way I wasn’t cut out for it. Now I have to figure out how to tell him if he wants to commit I will continue if not I need to end it. I got too emotionally attached from second one( MY mistake and I will NEVER do it again- live and learn?). I have been continuing to surf for others and have more than a few interested. Id like to see it “work” but Am I going to kick this dead horse as it seems or move on…any ideas? Afraid to have the talk but recently I decided I need to do it for ME…

  97. di,

    Everyone is not made for FWB; most people are not made for FWB. If you got emotionally attached once, it will happen again. My advice: just forget the whole FWB idea…

  98. Im having my second fwb right now and it all matters with agreeing with each other. if the both of yall doesnt want to settle down and dont want no emotional attachments and just a friendship then do it. my first fwb i had with this last guy, i got attached and got my feelings hurt, but this guy i got now, we both agreed to not get emotional attach, if the both of us dont want a relationship at this time. we still hangout as friends watching movies, go out to eat and let me say, the sex is fantastic :).

  99. cdchc4

    “Im having my second fwb right now and it all matters with agreeing with each other. if the both of yall doesnt want to settle down and dont want no emotional attachments and just a friendship then do it.”

    That’s easy in theory, not so easy in practice. Feelings don’t tend to care much about what you “agreed” upon earlier.

  100. I have a friend with benefit.at first it was okay n i enjoyed sex like never b4 n i ddnt have feelings 4 him bt after a year i developed feelings 4 him n now after 3 years i dnt enjoy da sex lyk b4 bt i,m still inlove wit him.help plz…shwanky

  101. Please, please, type in proper sentences!!!
    It is painful trying to decipher test speak!

  102. ;) @ Sophia

    Maleshwane,

    My advice would be: end it. No use trying to figure out how to begin a relationship with a friends with benefits where you don’t even enjoy the benefits. Sounds like a recipe for disaster.

  103. I agree with Alee. thats why it called Friends With Benefits coz u should benefit from it lol…
    anyways, i am in an FWB at the moment. why i choose or agreed on it? having a label as GF/BF gives more pressure, responsibility and theres the reporting or permission that you have to know the other persons whereabout. FWB is less drama. we argue also but not like the normal relationship that one person would really probed and needs to be wooed..us? simple explanation is enough. FWB don’t read or interpret every gestures. coz if u always read between the lines, that will give you wrong idea or view of what you had agreed on in the first place xxx

  104. My experience was the opposite. There was less stress, fewer expectations and thus it was easier to communicate, and since both of us were ready to let go, it was a pretty positive experience. Non clinging friends with benefits is the ideal, IMO, and marriage is a sign of fairytale idealism.

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